BUR #8667 has been rejected.
mass update koizumi_itsuki_(female) -> koizumi_itsuki genderswap_(mtf)
why does this exist
Posted under Tags
BUR #8667 has been rejected.
mass update koizumi_itsuki_(female) -> koizumi_itsuki genderswap_(mtf)
why does this exist
I would suggest instead a rename to Koizumi Ichihime. All Haruhi main characters have named genderswap versions on Danbooru so as The Bob pointed out, it feels weird to left him out of this. The pixiv tag for the genderswap is "古泉一姫", which reads as Koizumi Ichihime, a feminine sounding version of his name, just like the other Haruhi genderswaps.
EB said:
It's a different name, in kanji, as the wiki indicates. There is no reason this tag should be nuked unless it's consistently applied to all of the specific Haruhi genderswap names.
then we add the alternate name to itsuki's wiki write in it "genderswapped itsuki is also popular", just like how wriggle's wiki lists how commonly androgynous she is
all of the fan-made haruhi genderswaps dont have a real reason to exist, considering how popular genderswaps of every single copyright (genshin_impact genderswap) happen
this isnt a case like saotome ranma and ranma-chan, which is canon
mongirlfan said:
I would suggest instead a rename to Koizumi Ichihime. All Haruhi main characters have named genderswap versions on Danbooru so as The Bob pointed out, it feels weird to left him out of this.
if this goes through, im putting all of those tags up to nukes
mongirlfan said:
The pixiv tag for the genderswap is "古泉一姫", which reads as Koizumi Ichihime, a feminine sounding version of his name, just like the other Haruhi genderswaps.
It's not read by Japanese fans as "Ichihime" (いちひめ), though. It's read as "Itsuki" (いつき ), which is why the tag is the way it is to begin with.
mongirlfan said:
I would suggest instead a rename to Koizumi Ichihime. All Haruhi main characters have named genderswap versions on Danbooru so as The Bob pointed out, it feels weird to left him out of this. The pixiv tag for the genderswap is "古泉一姫", which reads as Koizumi Ichihime, a feminine sounding version of his name, just like the other Haruhi genderswaps.
The characters 一姫 for fem-Itsuki's name are actually still read as "Itsuki" - it's just a different kanji for the "ki" part. I don't think anyone calls him/her Ichihime in English. (I've seen "Itsuko" a few times.)
e: ninjaed by EB
mongirlfan said:
I see, I tried a translation tool which was reading the name like that. So, does that concludes that Itsuki's genderswap doesn't have any particular name?
Well, she does have a name: 一姫 Itsuki. It just happens to be read the same as 一樹 Itsuki, the male version's name, in English. Hence the clunky tag.
Since this is a kanji alternate reading issue, I suggest renaming it koizumi_itsuki_(ichihime).
Probably not the best idea but it's the most practical one if we want to keep Itsuki's Haruhi genderbent tag for fairness with the others while identifying that it's a different kanji with the same reading.
Anyone could search for Koizumi Itsuki genderswap without problems. I'm only in favor of the current tag because it makes more sense given the context IMO. Itsuko or Ichihime as qualifiers wouldn't change much, though I'd agree with any.
Genderswaps are normal across franchises indeed, but most are unnamed by fans for multiple reasons.
thelieutenant said:
then we add the alternate name to itsuki's wiki write in it "genderswapped itsuki is also popular", just like how wriggle's wiki lists how commonly androgynous she is
all of the fan-made haruhi genderswaps dont have a real reason to exist, considering how popular genderswaps of every single copyright (genshin_impact genderswap) happen
this isnt a case like saotome ranma and ranma-chan, which is canonif this goes through, im putting all of those tags up to nukes
I don't think it's fair to make either of those comparisons. Zhongli's nearly 400 genderswap posts is nothing to Kyonko's 2100, how many characters get that much genderswap art? Wriggle looks exactly the same whether she's a boy, girl, or something inbetween, Kyonko and Itsuki(mtf) are both distinctly recognizable from their normal counterparts, as well as having consistent designs, and are established enough to have their own names, though Itsuki's only works in Japanese.
blindVigil said:
I don't think it's fair to make either of those comparisons. Zhongli's nearly 400 genderswap posts is nothing to Kyonko's 2100, how many characters get that much genderswap art? Wriggle looks exactly the same whether she's a boy, girl, or something inbetween, Kyonko and Itsuki(mtf) are both distinctly recognizable from their normal counterparts, as well as having consistent designs, and are established enough to have their own names, though Itsuki's only works in Japanese.
Zhongli is actually a pretty good example. If its about numbers, genderswapped zhong started getting popular in 2021, with 359 posts in a single year. Kyonko's best year was 1110 in 2008, and then 461 in 2009, followed by 117 in 2010 and 234 in 2011 before she pretty much completely faded into obscurity and got maybe a dozen posts per year. I can predict zhong to be around 800 posts before she also starts to fade from popularity as genshin dies out.
I'm using zhong as an example because there was a pool dedicated to genderswapped zhong, who seems to have a fairly consistent design. It was nuked (forum #198996) because there was no point to its existence as it just filled a 2 tag search. The only reason why this Itsuki genderswap and kyonko exist is because oldbooru decided it without a strong reason other than "oh well its already here might as well keep it".
And their design isn't that great, especially itsuki's. Its literally just a girl with the same color hair, but long and wearing the female version of the school uniform. Their designs are uniform because theyre wearing uniforms. Kyonko's only defining characteristic is a ponytail, probably just because kyon said he liked ponytails in the episode where he kisses haruhi. Her cardigan is literally just the school uniform cardigan as well. This entire character is held up by a single alternate_hairstyle.
If its really about numbers, its because boys get the short end of the stick on this site because most of us are straight guys who dont want to see other guys. If danbooru had a stronger fujoshi fanbase they could probably find tons more kyon and itsuki to push those numbers up, but we dont. As neither of them are traps or baras, they just do not have the user strength to find all of the (likely ancient and/or deleted) art out there. Its a modern miracle that the genshin boys are getting this much art on this site at all.
If you want another example where the genderswapped version overtake the original version, theres Rei (cookie). Male Rei is given the nickname RI-kun, but both male and female Rei and tagged with RI-aneki on their images.
What about pictures with both kyon and kyonko? dual_persona genderswap kyon
I think it would be a fair comparison if Zhongli's and other Genshin genderswaps were stablished with individual names in its fanbase and tags on other sites.
If it was about being official, there are plenty of char tags due to convenience, rather than being official characters, like Craft Essences. If it was about numbers, I'd ask for a character tag for Zhongli's mtf since it has hundreds of uploads. Rei (cookie) seems to be a special case?
thelieutenant said:
all of the fan-made haruhi genderswaps dont have a real reason to exist, considering how popular genderswaps of every single copyright (genshin_impact genderswap) happen
this isnt a case like saotome ranma and ranma-chan, which is canonif this goes through, im putting all of those tags up to nukes
Given that there are other similar fan-made character tags that hypothetically should be easily found under character +personification or +humanization searches such as those under New Super Mario bros. U Deluxe, would you also propose nuking tags like Bowsette or Princess King Boo? Particularly if the humanization tag is made to implicate personification as has been suggested in topic #20261, which would make it safe to apply personification to all of them.
One ramification of these changes is the conversion of two tag searches into four tags searches. For example suzumiya_haruhiko kyonko (327 posts) would become suzumiya_haruhi kyon genderswap_(mtf) genderswap_(ftm). Likewise existing 3 tag searches also become 4 tag searches, female Haruhi +Kyonko goes from suzumiya_haruhi kyonko -genderswap_(ftm) (290 posts) to suzumiya_haruhi kyon genderswap_(mtf) -genderswap_(ftm). Once they're consolidated Kyon together with Haruhi genderswap posts become a lumped 617 posts, with nearly half posts female Haruhi and half posts male Haruhi together with female Kyon.
It would probably be a better approach instead of nuking such tags, that after several hundred posts of the character that they're treated as more of an original character that is derivative of the copyright character. After so many renditions, it's rather normal for fandom to start giving them character and personality traits that differ from their original source character, so they essentially are original characters.
Updated
NWF_Renim said:
Given that there are other similar fan-made character tags that hypothetically should be easily found under character +personification or +humanization searches such as those under New Super Mario bros. U Deluxe, would you also propose nuking tags like Bowsette or Princess King Boo? Particularly if the humanization tag is made to implicate personification as has been suggested in topic #20261, which would make it safe to apply personification to all of them.
I would not nuke either of those because they contain both significant character and design differences from their original character. The haruhi characters are just wearing the opposite gender's school uniform, with maybe a change in hair length. I don't really know whats going on in the human/personification thread.
One ramification of these changes is the conversion of two tag searches into four tags searches. For example suzumiya_haruhiko kyonko (327 posts) would become suzumiya_haruhi kyon genderswap_(mtf) genderswap_(ftm). Likewise existing 3 tag searches also become 4 tag searches, female Haruhi +Kyonko goes from suzumiya_haruhi kyonko -genderswap_(ftm) (290 posts) to suzumiya_haruhi kyon genderswap_(mtf) -genderswap_(ftm). Once they're consolidated Kyon together with Haruhi genderswap posts become a lumped 617 posts, with nearly half posts female Haruhi and half posts male Haruhi together with female Kyon.
This would just be like every other copyright then. Although the tag count is small, morichika_rinnosuke genderswap_(mtf) kirisame_marisa genderswap_(ftm) requires just as many tags. Haruhi got so many genderswap posts because its about alternate universes and a fickle god that changes anything she wants. I don't know if there are a lot of other animes with a similar premise, but during my stints on tumblr I saw a decent amount of gender reversal Doctor Who and Marvel. Its the nature of the genre that causes fans to draw genderswaps.
It would probably be a better approach instead of nuking such tags, that after several hundred posts of the character that they're treated as more of an original character that is derivative of the copyright character. After so many renditions, it's rather normal for fandom to start giving them character and personality traits that differ from their original source character, so they essentially are original characters.
Are they? After browsing through the genderswap haruhi doujins on e-hentai, I really don't see how their characters are different from the (fanon) non-genderswapped versions. I chose Itsuki in particular for this BUR because s/he has the least change in personality of the main cast. Fanon Itsuki is a gay pervert, so is the genderswapped variant. Nagato stays a stoic tsundere-lite no matter what. Haruhi stays with their short attention span and constant plans for the SOS brigade. Asahina stays nervous and shy, but instead of big boobs its a big dick. Kyon stays the straight-man of the group who has to put up with haruhi's shit. Only the explicit doujins have any modicum of personality change, which usually means kyon -> kyonko is just reduced to "girl getting dicked".
thelieutenant said:
I would not nuke either of those because they contain both significant character and design differences from their original character. The haruhi characters are just wearing the opposite gender's school uniform, with maybe a change in hair length.
I don't really think that's fair; the design changes might not be a complete visual overhaul, but these Haruhi genderswaps have pretty much universally accepted designs (and names) among fan artists and fandom in general, which to me partly justifies them having their own tags (along with tag count), unlike genderswaps in most other fandoms that usually end up having completely different designs depending on whatever artist draws them and are just known as "[name] genderswap".
Some Zhongli genderswaps, for example, I wouldn't even be able to tell are supposed to be Zhongli until the tag list tells me so, and you've got stuff ranging from post #4782493 to post #5016853 with some post #4527853 along the way and even stuff like post #5036229.
The bulk update request #8667 (forum #204462) has been rejected by @DanbooruBot.