Given both Trouble and Kalp, as well as myself, are in the Discord server, just as discussion is developing here, so is it there. For transparency's sake, here's what has been discussed so there's no division. And just for future reference, this discussion is happening in parallel to the one in topic #31158.
I raised that Kalp had a technical point in stating;
The posts you retagged featuring Blaze's maid outfit alongside Silver's butler outfit, in combat stances, are direct references to a Japanese-language story featured on Sonic Channel.
because we do have copyrights such as One Piece Straw Hat Space (an example of a copytag for copyright-related radio shows to tag stuff specifically referencing it), so a tag for referencing stuff specifically from the stories that originate on Sonic Channel has some merit, but he'd only be able to argue it on that point, so that would likely eliminate most posts under Blaze the Cat (Maid), as without a doubt most art under that tag does not reference the story it originally appeared in.
Trouble proceeded to comment on how the accusation of "Replacing it with the game tag misrepresents the source" from Kalp fell flat as he seemingly didn't notice that post #8077539's commentary specifically referenced Sonic Speed Simulator (and so Trouble just readded the tag Kalp wrongly removed), and it was there that Kalp brought up that the patch notes for when Maid Blaze was added in Sonic Speed Simulator reference Sonic Channel, which didn't really add to his point. The remainder of the responses will be presented in full.
KalpacMuskoxen said:
I don't know what the argument is - if it debuts in SS or SC?
Trouble_Windows said:
the argument is that sonic channel isn't a piece of media. it's just a website they put artwork on sometimes. sometimes outfits from that artwork get used in actual media, sometimes they don't. but it's like saying that any fanart of official art from some game's twitter should use the twitter as the copyright tag
KalpacMuskoxen said:
okay but then what is the copytag of this post #8087293
Trouble_Windows said:
... sonic_(series) + official_alternate_costume
the notable ones have chartags anyways so it's not like you can't search for them otherwise. the ones that don't get fanart and such don't need tagging beyond what any other franchise does for random one-off official costumes
Damian0358 said:
Your argument is that because it debuted in SC, it should have that as a copytag, when the counterargument is that its appearance in SS makes it ambiguous whether or not the fanart is supposed to be for SC now. It's like how we shouldn't tag Rosalina with super_mario_galaxy anymore after appearing in Super Mario 3D World because now she's gotten broad enough that her fanart is no longer explicitly a reference to her debut game.
KalpacMuskoxen said:
also the copytag of any Sonic costume only appearing in Sonic Channel and not being used anywhere else
Damian0358 said:
And how many of those are there on Danbooru?
KalpacMuskoxen said:
undertagged
example: post #8970957
Pickle and Amy's outfits are from Sonic Channel, Zazz's is from SFSB
post #8697194
Damian0358 said:
Kalp, if you had brought this up earlier, do you not think you'd have a bit less pushback?
Trouble_Windows said:
i mean, i'd still disagree, but leading with this would have definitely been better
Damian0358 said:
And this rolls back to the point I made about making a thread sooner. You lost control of the discussion.
KalpacMuskoxen said:
I had no idea there would be pushback to a copytag being used.... correctly
Damian0358 said:
But here's the thing, you think it's being used correctly, and you're getting pushback because others view it as incorrect. And with your constant meddling with Sonic costume tags, someone was going to notice the copytag sooner or later.
KalpacMuskoxen said:
then what do we tag these as, aside from individually posting "hey this is actually a reference to this" in the comments
Damian0358 said:
Don't ask me, this isn't the forum.
Trouble_Windows said:
your argument doesn't work when that's how most other copyrights are handled
in regards to referencing one-off official/promotional/etc art
KalpacMuskoxen said:
Do most other copyright have a designated website analagous to Sonic Channel that consistently features its own namesake branding in their artwork?
or have a series of webnovels...?
that feature unique and original character outfits that other people draw a lot?
Trouble_Windows said:
no, but if they do, i don't think they'd be tagged either
KalpacMuskoxen said:
then it's purely speculative
Trouble_Windows said:
people draw original and unique character outfits from official and promotional art all the time, i don't think sonic posting offical art on a dedicated website makes it somehow an exception
you can also always note a chartagged costume's official art origin in the wiki page, the tags should be beneficial for searching, not just giving the viewer meta information.
should we tag all art of Blaze's summer costume as just sonic_the_hedgehog_(idw) because it was from a variant cover before it was in a game? i don't think that would benefit users searching very much - either users who don't know this searching for the game it appears in, OR users who are searching the idw tag for actual art of the idw comics.
(i did actually do that by default before i knew it was in sss and recieved its official name there, but in hindsight, if i was searching sonic idw i'd be irritated to see posts like that, y'know?)
