post #9000000 GET!
Danbooru

Perfect Feet pool, and other moderated collections

Posted under General

I'm referencing pool #109 specifically because I've recently made it public, and have since talked with miragio about the proper way to handle it, but it's a more general issue.

Basically, we have many pools with semi-subjective themes, particularly all the "Perfect *" ones. Much like judging posts good enough to be on danbooru, judging whether a post is a "perfect" specimen or not is inherently subjective. Opening them up completely is probably bound to yield something similar to the current "Disgustingly Adorable" mess, just with more porn for body parts. Yet closing them down completely means one person gets to decide fully what goes in, and moreover is the only one who can do anything about the pool, so they become a bottleneck. And if they go away for holidays or something, the pool gets stalled.

Moreover, it's not a given that their taste is perfect and flawless. I for one disagree with large parts of what miragio has included in pool #109, sometimes very much so. But everybody having their personal perfect feet pool is not workable either, if only for the simple reason all pools generate a navigation box, and that you'd have to explain their existence to the outsiders somehow.

For pool #109 I've been working around it with my mod powers, but it's very much not a workable solution in the general case. What we really need, I think, is:

  • Splitting current "pools" into two related, but separate concepts: "series" and "collections".
    • Series are posts which have a defined order, ie. sequential comics. For them the order is of prime importance, and they're more or less objective: either a post belongs to a series or not. Of course you can always get weird corner cases, but it's a good enough approximation.
    • Collections are sets of otherwise unrelated posts that share some common characteristic. Ie. thematic pools. They don't have a strictly defined order, and the inclusion criteria are likely to be at least partially arbitrary.
  • The ability to have completely private pools. They'd be essentially a specialised version of favourites, and not at all like the public pools which result in a huge, obnoxious UI box for everyone browsing their posts.
  • The ability to have collective ownership of collections, or rather per-collection moderation teams. There would need to be some kind of dispute resolution system (just a forum thread linked from the description should suffice), specific rules and guidelines for content, and a submission system. People were dmailing miragio with submissions to pool #109, but that obviously falls apart if you have more than one "owner".

What we also need is to work out some sort of a substitute while there're no technical means to implement any of the above. One solution is to open up all pools, and have several more or less formally appointed "mods" scan all changes and fix what they deem wrong. Another is to stick with private pools where we have the private for the time being. I'm not sure which one is better, and there might be more proposals I'm not seeing currently.

Updated by DschingisKhan

The pulldown thing you can eliminate by unchecking "active". You can still add things by using pool:[number] or pool:name_with_spaces_replaced_with_underscores in the tag field. Honestly, the pulldown menu thing could be removed entirely as far as I'm concerned.

But other than that, yeah, I'm in full agreement and also have the feeling I've suggested something along these lines.

Fencedude said:
Also, is there any particular reason pool #208 is locked? It focus is very objective, so I don't see any reason for nanami to be the only one able to add to it.

Couldn't that just be a tag anyway? I was thinking that before about that pool.

S1eth said:
Two existing tag combinations for this are bare_legs bunny_suit and bunny_suit -pantyhose -thighhighs.

The latter really isn't good as it could possibly exclude a lot of legitimate images when there's more than one character.

NWF_Renim said:
The bare_legs tag seems like a bad idea to me, should it even exist? Bare legs are way too common to be tagged imo.

I don't know. We have barefoot (which is very, very common), so why not? I think it would be good to at least focus this tag on specific outfits or characters known to often come with pantyhose or thighhighs (which would be kind of like no_glasses).

I think everything in the OP is a great idea. "Series" vs "collection" has been an issue brought up many times already. Short series are clumsy in the current pool implementation and fixed ordering doesn't make a whole lot of sense for collections.

Private pools are also an excellent idea that has been brought up in the past. since there seems to be a lot of demand for people to own pools and have them exactly as they like without excessive moderation, but having a lot of such pools clutters the pool list and interface.

スラッシュ said:
The pulldown thing you can eliminate by unchecking "active". You can still add things by using pool:[number] or pool:name_with_spaces_replaced_with_underscores in the tag field. Honestly, the pulldown menu thing could be removed entirely as far as I'm concerned.

Then obligatory voicing that I'd like it to stay because I use it all the time. I don't get why our views are so different on this still.

> Not convinced about the collections moderation teams but +1 to the rest basically.

Cyberia-Mix said:
Then obligatory voicing that I'd like it to stay because I use it all the time.

Likewise. I don't trust myself to remember and type the precise name of a given pool when tagging things as pool:pool_name, and I think the default behavior of creating a new pool without requesting confirmation is a bit silly.

Also, in Chrome (and Firefox, if I recall), I can type with focus on the dropdown menu and the entire phrase is treated as a prefix; for instance, "Touhou - Han" gets me "Touhou - Hang in There, Kogasa-san (mizuki hitoshi)" rather than selecting the first pool that starts with 'n'. Thanks to this behavior, the length of the pool list is irrelevant to me as long as I can remember the first few letters, and I'm still spared having to remember every last character of the pool name.

The "huge, obnoxious UI box" is the "Pool: << The Perfect Feet >> Posts" box, the one that stacks with other boxes on top of the image itself.

If you don't want to see/use the dropdown box (not the box mentioned above), you can use the DanbooruUp tag auto-completion (which does not yet auto-update "pool:"-tags).

スラッシュ said:
I gave you a solution for this problem. If you choose to use an obviously broken system, it's not my problem.

Dude. The dropdown doesn't even appear until you click "Add to pool". That's not what I was talking about.

Hmm... that gives me an idea actually. How's about we have a "Pool" button right below the current "Add to pool"? If we click this button, all the pools this image belongs to will appear, no need to have the cumbersome boxes anymore.

This, however, will have trouble with going to the "next" and "previous" images in the same pool.

The boxes aren't THAT obnoxious. I only want the "series" box to be always above the "collection" box and distinguishable (by color, height, etc). All "collection" links can be in a single one-line box below the "series" box with its content floated left. That means you will never have more than 2 boxes.

Can a post be in more than one series?

Edit (before, during and after glasnost's reply):
Suggestion 2: Have pools in the sidebar above or below "Tags". Example for post #391883:
Pools
? + << >> Touhou_-_Life_of_Maid_(colonel_aki)

Cons:

  • pool names can be longer than the sidebar
  • next/prev button harder to find than in the box.

While editing, I read glasnost's reply:
To avoid the navigation problem, this could be used for collections only. (without the << >>)

Updated

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