Tagging tiny "watermark" characters unrelated to the main piece

Lynx190 said:
Also I'm developing a suspicion the commissioner and said user are the same person, considering how many of them seem to have been uploaded by him and how persistent he is with the tagging. It really gives me the vibes of artists who slap tags of all the popular franchises on their art to force people to stumble across it (90s search engines and the html meta tag, anyone?) Although I don't notice it on the pixiv source pages in this case, but then pixiv also has a 10-tag limit.

Going through their comment history, I also think the same thing - aside from the fact that they just happen to have the same interests as the commissioner, there's also the fact that they had post #3190135 available to upload for some reason, despite no available source.

In any case the tagger has ended up controlling an artist's tag for some purpose.

I don't find them useful for those images, but I don't like the implication that removing them from these images would have for other images.

I've created character watermark for this. Go ahead and remove any tags that only appear in the watermark.

In tagging this I found that in the earliest versions of this watermark the characters were more like easter eggs than spam, so we may want to leave those alone.

evazion said:

I've created character watermark for this. Go ahead and remove any tags that only appear in the watermark.

In tagging this I found that in the earliest versions of this watermark the characters were more like easter eggs than spam, so we may want to leave those alone.

You also added solo_focus to posts that were previously tagged solo. Should character watermark be considered incompatible with solo?

No, on some posts I did an undo of earlier edits adding these characters and solo focus was readded by that. Characters only in the watermark shouldn't count towards the number of characters in the scene.

@Entweihen: Please don't readd these tags. This has been discussed and the majority of people agreed these characters shouldn't be tagged. Further edit warring over these posts will be considered tag vandalism.

evazion said:

@Entweihen: Please don't readd these tags. This has been discussed and the majority of people agreed these characters shouldn't be tagged. Further edit warring over these posts will be considered tag vandalism.

Why so? I don't think it violates any rules and they are pertinent on the picture as far as relevancy goes.

Is restoring something that was removed despite being relevant really vandalism?

Entweihen said:

Why so? I don't think it violates any rules and they are pertinent on the picture as far as relevancy goes.

Is restoring something that was removed despite being relevant really vandalism?

Read the thread.

Mysterious_Uploader said:

Read the thread.

I have. And there is nothing that is against the rules. In fact, what is suggested here is pretty dangerous. There are other pictures with characters as small or perhaps even more out of focus than the ones posted, and yet they'd fall under this blanket adjustment people in this thread are suggesting.

Unless of course, this is some personal vendetta.

I'm gonna have to go against the grain here but I really don't get why we can't just tag them as character_name_(cameo) like it's already done for other cases, and skip the copyright tag in case of cameos.

Not tagging them at all seems obtuse and goes against common sense. People are just gonna keep tagging them because they are in the picture, so good luck constantly trying to garden all of chartags:>1.

I half agree with nonamethanks here, I don't think character_name_(cameo) tags are a good idea (even more weird to not have the copyright tags) but I still think the characters should be tagged in some way or another.

I do agree with nonamethanks here too, his idea solves both the problem of copyright/character flooding and leaving the characters untagged.

Unbreakable said:

I half agree with nonamethanks here, I don't think character_name_(cameo) tags are a good idea (even more weird to not have the copyright tags) but I still think the characters should be tagged in some way or another.

Using the cameo tag means that it still shows in the autocomplete as a result, making the user who's searching for it aware that there's more pictures, while avoiding the copyright tag and the original character tag means it doesn't pollute the "main" tags. But not having them tagged at all is loss of information and it seems to me like one of those ideas that sound great in practice but then become unenforceable and after a year become something that nobody wants to even think about because of the mess it created.

I have to agree with nonamethanks and Unbreakable too. Some people will still tag them and somebody has to garden it everytime - and in the worst case somebody will retag them, because they think it's right.

My concern is there are other pictures, based on the enforcement action above, that should be 'wiped' clean also. For example, in the Mutsu_(snail) tag alone these should be scrubbed of the Mutsu_(snail) tag also:

post #3509911
post #3172888
post #3170358

Unless you feel that my case is exceptional enough that you'd change potentially hundreds (maybe even...thousands) of pictures with smaller characters or off-focus appearances to comply with what you had before. If not, then it's clearly a personal issue.

In fact, if I can make a suggestion, you can just blacklist Mutsu_(snail). Alot of the commissioner's works, even collaborations, always have these.

Entweihen said:

My concern is there are other pictures, based on the enforcement action above, that should be 'wiped' clean also. For example, in the Mutsu_(snail) tag alone these should be scrubbed of the Mutsu_(snail) tag also:

post #3509911
post #3172888
post #3170358

Unless you feel that my case is exceptional enough that you'd change potentially hundreds (maybe even...thousands) of pictures with smaller characters or off-focus appearances to comply with what you had before. If not, then it's clearly a personal issue.

In fact, if I can make a suggestion, you can just blacklist Mutsu_(snail). Alot of the commissioner's works, even collaborations, always have these.

For more examples you can check chibi inset. A lot of those should have their character tags removed as per policy of this thread apparently.

Back on topic, I've yet to see any rules that I've broken thus far. Sure, one can argue that what has been done by the commissioner may be unethical, but under no grounds does it fall under 'vandalization' to restore these removed yet relevant tags. Pardon me for attacking the Admin's right, but if anything, removing said relevant tags is in and of itself tag vandalism. Therefore, I don't quite see how it would be just or proper to punish for restoring relevant tags.

For the record I directly talk with the commissioner on Discord where he shares his works hence why some of the pictures I've posted thus far often constitute the uncensored versions.

However, if there is a specific rule that I am violating in tagging the pictures above with the memes present, do say and I will discuss it with the commissioner. Otherwise, I feel this is simply personal as opposed to a proper issue with regards to the rules.

nonamethanks said:

For more examples you can check chibi inset. A lot of those should have their character tags removed as per policy of this thread apparently.

Hm. That does seem like an inconvenient predicament.

Though an easier thing would either to blacklist my account so that the commissioner's work won't be seen. Though it may not be able to stop most of those pictures (I believe there were a few other pictures posted by another user for their end of a collaboration) but adding the blacklist on the Mutsu_(snail) tag would cover all bases there.

nonamethanks said:

For more examples you can check chibi inset. A lot of those should have their character tags removed as per policy of this thread apparently.

No, not really. There's a difference between chibi characters that have something tangentially to do with the drawing and the meme spam that serves only to disrupt tag searching.

I also think it's unnecessary to change tagging rules for all pictures for what is clearly a specific case.

Entweihen said:
In fact, if I can make a suggestion, you can just blacklist Mutsu_(snail). Alot of the commissioner's works, even collaborations, always have these.

It's troubling to suggest that people have to blacklist an unrelated meme when there's no way of knowing beforehand that a searcher would have to do such a thing, and unreasonable to expect everyone to stop what they're doing just to add something to the blacklist. It's especially bad to have to blacklist it if they are looking for the snail in earnest.

Entweihen said:

Unless you feel that my case is exceptional enough that you'd change potentially hundreds (maybe even...thousands) of pictures with smaller characters or off-focus appearances to comply with what you had before. If not, then it's clearly a personal issue.

It's because this case is exceptional that we can deal with the problematic tagging without affecting all other posts en masse.

DreamFromTheLayer said:

I also think it's unnecessary to change tagging rules for all pictures for what is clearly a specific case.

It's not a specific case though. I don't see the difference between the artist in question's signature chibis and posts like post #3741751, post #904907 (Cu chulainn), post #3673893 (Leonardo in the second panel), post #3654771, post #3677004, post #3709498 and countless others where there's cursory references that are often used as a stand-in for the artist's or audience's reaction to the image. It's pretty common for this kind of inset to be found in official manga too. The whole argument of people not expecting these posts to show up when they're searching for their character tags applies to the posts above too. There's hundreds of different examples by different artists.

I really don't see why we can't use the *_(cameo) tags for this like we've always done.

DreamFromTheLayer

Fair. So do tell me what rule I am precisely breaking. I've linked pictures with off references even smaller than what the uploaded commissions show, yet they're not under consideration to be cleaned up.

Otherwise, it just seems like your personal spite that's driving this, something that isn't beholden to the rules you imply to uphold.