imply promotional art and game cg to official art

BUR #42967 is pending approval.

create implication promotional_art -> official_art
create implication game_cg -> official_art

previous: promotional art: topic #20247, game cg: topic #21273
Time to talk about some elephants in the room. The biggest counterargument in previous discussions is the presence of fan works. But Looking at how they're actually tagged, and several mentions of fan games in the forums such as topic #21273, the general conscious is that "official arts of fan works are still official arts of their own", not to mention that these fan works have fan arts of their own too.

The rest of original promotional_art are mostly the same as original official_art, bigger elephant.

1. Small copyright that doesn't have a tag. This is not difficult, just a lot of work.
2. Artist's one-shots, exhibition, doujin, merch, etc.
3. Artist's own illustration series that is beyond a one-shot. It's a bit hard to define how "official" they are, since it varies from doodle to serious production. Some of them are already "promoted" because the artist released something like a game, manga or novel. Others might have a copytag, or just character tags. With the increasing amount of them we should establish some sort of guideline, the importance is something people can agree with.

Regardless, putting these tags under official art and figuring out what does and what doesn't count as "official'' is still easier than having a dozen tags each with a slightly different definition that are identical in practice.

magcolo said:

BUR #42967 is pending approval.

create implication promotional_art -> official_art
create implication game_cg -> official_art

previous: promotional art: topic #20247, game cg: topic #21273
Time to talk about some elephants in the room. The biggest counterargument in previous discussions is the presence of fan works. But Looking at how they're actually tagged, and several mentions of fan games in the forums such as topic #21273, the general conscious is that "official arts of fan works are still official arts of their own", not to mention that these fan works have fan arts of their own too.

The rest of original promotional_art are mostly the same as original official_art, bigger elephant.

1. Small copyright that doesn't have a tag. This is not difficult, just a lot of work.
2. Artist's one-shots, exhibition, doujin, merch, etc.
3. Artist's own illustration series that is beyond a one-shot. It's a bit hard to define how "official" they are, since it varies from doodle to serious production. Some of them are already "promoted" because the artist released something like a game, manga or novel. Others might have a copytag, or just character tags. With the increasing amount of them we should establish some sort of guideline, the importance is something people can agree with.

Regardless, putting these tags under official art and figuring out what does and what doesn't count as "official'' is still easier than having a dozen tags each with a slightly different definition that are identical in practice.

Disagree on Game CG’s due to stuff like Fate/Empire Of Dirt existing, unofficial VNs and Fan games can have CGs as well.

Iseseith said:

Disagree on Game CG’s due to stuff like Fate/Empire Of Dirt existing, unofficial VNs and Fan games can have CGs as well.

...That are officially from said game, regardless of that game's status.

Confetto said:

...That are officially from said game, regardless of that game's status.

I don't aggressively disagree, but do we actually have a standard for these? If a fan-comic gets fan art does that automatically make the fan comic official art?

Weird situation, not opposed to fan game CGs being official, but I'd like confirmation on any precedents before voting.

zetsubousensei said:

I don't aggressively disagree, but do we actually have a standard for these? If a fan-comic gets fan art does that automatically make the fan comic official art?

Weird situation, not opposed to fan game CGs being official, but I'd like confirmation on any precedents before voting.

I don't think art from say the Fate/Grand Order Alternative doujinn book Would get the "official art" tag despite being officially from it vs say the one piece of fan art on here of it's Alter version of Mash.

EDIT: Even from a searching standpoint that's silly, if someone's looking for [insert series here] official art, they're looking for official art of that series, not art from fan works.

zetsubousensei said:

I don't aggressively disagree, but do we actually have a standard for these? If a fan-comic gets fan art does that automatically make the fan comic official art?

Weird situation, not opposed to fan game CGs being official, but I'd like confirmation on any precedents before voting.

It was discussed in topic #21273 a bit and I do know there is precedent: touhou_lostword official_art, touhou_mystia's_izakaya official_art

Iseseith said:

EDIT: Even from a searching standpoint that's silly, if someone's looking for [insert series here] official art, they're looking for official art of that series, not art from fan works.

But people searching for the fan work + official art would be. These cases aren't common enough for fan work art to ever make up a significant portion of the overall copyright's official art search.

Confetto said:

But people searching for the fan work + official art would be. These cases aren't common enough for fan work art to ever make up a significant portion of the overall copyright's official art search.

And if it does, then maybe the copytags should be separated from each other to avoid tag pollution.

Ylimegirl said:

And if it does, then maybe the copytags should be separated from each other to avoid tag pollution.

Couldn't this just be solved by making a tag for "official" art for fan works if that makes sense or something of the like.

Iseseith said:

Couldn't this just be solved by making a tag for "official" art for fan works if that makes sense or something of the like.

Having separate tags for "official art from official game A" and "official art for game B but the game is actually unofficially derived from game A so we need to classify it separately because while it's official to game B it's not official to game A even though we consider unofficial game B to be linked enough to official game A to have an implication for it" is tremendously stupid and pedantic. It's not like we don't already have "tag pollution" for official art from crossovers, like when Chloe von Einzbern appeared in Grand Summoners—posts are tagged with both copyrights even though it's not "official" to Fate/Kaleid Liner Prisma Illya.

I think there are some compelling pedantic arguments for things like video game mods being excluded but touhou official_art for instance is almost half touhou lostword already so I don't really think this implication would meaningfully shift searchability and it seems things are tagged this way already.

If we are talking about fan games, fan movie or something, for me it's acceptable. Fanmade goods (post #8613726)? I don't really think it's ok, unless there are alternative designs that can clearly distinguish the promoted characters from the original ones.

Who I consider to be official is the copyright holder though.

We could make official_fanwork_art (or however we want to call it, this name makes it sound like it's "art from an official fanwork" so it's not really great) for official art from derivative works. That way it can be excluded when searching for official art.

nonamethanks said:

We could make official_fanwork_art (or however we want to call it, this name makes it sound like it's "art from an official fanwork" so it's not really great) for official art from derivative works. That way it can be excluded when searching for official art.

That's what I was suggesting as well, Maybe something closer to Fanwork Creator's Art (Sounds a bit odd IK, but gets the idea across) could do.

nonamethanks said:

We could make official_fanwork_art (or however we want to call it, this name makes it sound like it's "art from an official fanwork" so it's not really great) for official art from derivative works. That way it can be excluded when searching for official art.

Or Fanwork Official Art.

BUR #44383 is pending approval.

create implication guest_art -> official_art

As defined in the wiki, guest art is a type of official art.